Gr> Who says you have to go there? Who decree'd it? Who created this Hell
Gr> for you to burn in?
The Lord God. He said "the soul that sins shall die". He also said "I
have no pleasure in the death of those who die in their sins". But, if
we constantly thumb our nose at Him, and refuse to heed The Gospel, then
he will sorrowfully let us go on our merry way.
Satan and his demonic hordes are laughing at you, because one day (if
you have no intention on accepting God's Free Love Gift), God will turn
you over to eternal doom, giving you what you desired.
Gr> How could you save yourself? You had no agency to doom yourself, so
Gr> how can you have any agency to save yourself?
Salvation is saving ones self from eternal doom and torment in The Lake
Of Fire.
Gr> Ok. Whatever that means. I guess you all just like to take pride in
Gr> being humble.
Righteousness is usually defined as purity, such as a bride on her wedding
day in white.
Gr> Salvation from what? From who? By what criteria?
Salvation from eternal torment in The Lake Of Fire, from Almighty God, and
by His Criteria. Admission into Heaven means that you would have had to have
lived a life WITHOUT one single evil word, thought, or deed...in other words,
PERFECTION. I know of no one who has walked the Earth (except for Jesus
Christ, God in the Flesh) who was sinless.
Gr> Why was such an act like that required of a god who knows all, sees
Gr> all, and wrote the book on everything before creating everything?
Because God says that "Without the shedding of blood, there is no
remission for sin". Before The Foundation Of The World, God's Only
Begotten Son, The Lord Jesus Christ, God In The Flesh, the Lamb Of God,
was slain. It was in God's Divine Plan that He take upon Himself the sins
of everyone who would ever live, bearing His Own Judgment upon Himself,
dying on The Cross, victorious over death and Hell in rising from the dead
3 days later. He said that "All who come to Me, I will in no way cast out".
Gr> Then all he had was a bad weekend. If you believe those stories.
The reason for the 3 days and nights, is that the Jews believed that
from the 4th day after death, there was no way someone could come back
to life from the dead. Yet, Jesus raised Lazarus from the dead after 4
days, which angered the Saducees, who didn't believe in life after death,
just like the athiests. But, the Scripture noted that "God would not allow
His Holy Son to see decay".
Jesus also noted to the Pharisees, who wanted "a sign" that He was who He
said he was, and He replied "Just as Jonah was in the belly of the whale 3
days and nights, so The Son Of Man will be in the belly of the Earth 3 days
and nights".
An aside to that is where in a class where this teacher was doubting a
child telling the story about a man being swallowed whole by a whale, being
in his belly for 3 days, and being vomited out onto dry land, still alive.
Normally, the digestive juices would literally "eat anything alive" in the
stomach. She asked the little girl how she knew the story was true. The
little girl said "When I get to Heaven, I'll ask Jonah". The teacher then
asked "What if Jonah isn't in Heaven??", and without batting an eye, the
little girl said "Then, I guess you'll ask him" (in Hell).
Gr> Of course he is. What messiah worshiping cult would be without the
Gr> impending return. How embarrassing would it be for you if it already
Gr> came and left without saying hello.
He will return in two phases...first, to Rapture His Church, then 7
years later to save the believing remnant of Jews from being destroyed.
Josh McDowell, in his book, "Evidence That Demands A Verdict", notes
three categories that Jesus Christ could be...the first two are what
the world feels He is (and from your posts, you likely feel the same);
but the third one is what He claims to be.
1) Liar - If everything He said and did was false, then ALL of us...
present company included...are headed for eternal doom in The Lake
Of Fire. But, the Apostles and so many others throughout history could
have easily recanted their belief and faith in Jesus Christ...yet, they
chose to die tortuous, violent deaths instead. They were eyewitnesses of
His Majesty, and besides, WHO WOULD DIE FOR A LIE??
After Adam and Eve disobeyed God in the Garden Of Eden, God spoke of
His Plan of Redemption. Satan wasted no time in setting up counterfeit
plans. The Bible also notes that "When Satan lies, he speaks his native
language".
2) Lunatic - The Jews feel that He was, at best, either a misunderstood
rabbi, who didn't have all his marbles together...or at worst, He was a
deceiving blasphemer. He was not "The Messiah" they wanted...a godlike
warrior who would throw off Roman Rule, and usher in the Millenial
Kingdom. When He told them that He was "the only way to Heaven", the
Jews (and the rest of the world) was furious.
3) Lord - He is who He claims to be, and what you do with Him will
determine whether you go to Heaven or Hell. You can either bow down to
Him eagerly in this life; or be compelled to on Judgment Day, before
He regretfully casts you into The Lake Of Fire.
As noted so many times, if I'm wrong, I'm not worried. But, if you
are wrong, your death will be the start of your problems. And, I can't
go to Hell...because I've done "the one thing that God requires"
(believing on The One He Has Sent), He counts me as "righteous",
although it's the Righteousness of Christ, and NONE of my own.
Gr> So this god sets arbitrary standards that you have to appease in order
Gr> to... what?
He made The Rules, starting with The 10 Commandments. He also noted in The
Bible that "If you broke His Law at one point, you broke it at all points".
DS> 9) Gratefully accepting His Free Love Gift made me worthy to go to
DS> Heaven.
Gr> What's so great about heaven? I see that people have more stories
Gr> about hell than they do heavan. Sell it to me. Why is it so great?
Look at the message on "Your First 6 Days In Hell" that I just posted.
You can laugh about it all you want, but I guarantee you that's what you
and all the other unsaved souls will experience if they refuse to accept
Christ.
Gr> Cool story. I understand that you believe what you believe. I just
Gr> don't understand why you chose to believe it. What supporting evidence
Gr> did you find to chose one faith over another.
Because the other religions and their gods said I had to die for them, and
I had to do all these things to gain access to Paradise...with no guarantee
that I would "make the grade".
With Christianity, its God died for ME, and said all I had to do to be worthy
of Heaven, was to accept what His Son, Jesus Christ, did for me on Calvary.
With Christ, I have "the peace that passes all understanding", and have seen
far too many instances of Him working in my life, that it trumps your
constant saying God doesn't exist.
Gr> What if your stories and beliefs were not true and correct? What if
Gr> the thing you want most is nothing but air and vapor?
I'm willing to stake my eternity on what Jesus Christ did for me. If that
doesn't get me into Heaven, nothing will.
After the Rapture of The Church, because all those who refused to accept
God's Free Love Gift and The Truth Of His Word, were left behind, instead
of being taken to Heaven..."God will send them strong delusion, that they
should believe a lie". In short, since they wanted to believe the lie, He
will let them believe it with all their hearts...and He will judge them
for rejecting The Truth, and believing The Lie.
Gr> In the news right now, Ken Ham has built an ark according to the
Gr> specifications found in your bible. That boondoggle has claimed $18
Gr> million dollars of public, tax payer money. Kentucky is not a rich
Gr> state, and that money, instead of feeding the poor, or giving services
Gr> to those in need, is now going as an offering to a snake-oil salesman.
The actual Ark is on Mount Ararat. I would refer you to a tract on that,
but your postings show me that you are not at all interested in The Gospel.
I feel that I am casting pearls before swine in trying to witness to you,
when you obviously have no interest in the Gospel.
Gr> People of your faith are driving a wedge between all of our peoples and
Gr> biblically calling for sanctioned discrimination against people who
Gr> their faith tells them to hate.
How many times do I have to tell you that GOD MADE THE RULES, and that
man's laws will NEVER supercede God's Laws??
Gr> People of your faith who pray to your god, are foregoing medical aid in
Gr> lieu of prayer for their critically ill children. The news is rife
Gr> with reports of parents who let their children die, in some cases ALL
Gr> their children die, from a easily treated illness. Because they chose
Gr> to pray instead of seek medical attention.
Jesus Christ is The Great Physician, and the ULTIMATE healing for a child
of God, is to be called home to Heaven. He can choose to heal them
physically, or not. And, His Divine Will is going to be accomplished,
whether mankind likes it or not.
Those who have died in the faith are RIGHT NOW enjoying the joy and bliss of
Heaven, with no sorrow, pain, cares of this life, sin, etc. He will bring these
souls with Him at the Rapture, to receive their new resurrection bodies. God's
ways are NOT our ways, and many times, people become bitter toward God, because
they thought "He gave them a bum steer", by "letting their loved one die".
When, in the space of a year, I lost in death, my grandmother-in-law, my
father, my wife, my best man, and nearly lost my brother in a freak
motorcycle wreck, I could've been bitter, folded up my tent, and been
gone within 2 weeks...but I resolved "that's not for me". God still has
me here on Earth for a reason. I wasn't bitter about these going to be
with The Lord...their work on Earth was done. And, I know that either by
death or Rapture, mine will be as well.
Yet, as the Apostle Paul notes "Eye hasn't seen, ear hasn't heard, or
has entered into the heart of man...the things that God has prepared for
those who love Him". I know Christians who died and went to Heaven, and
were brought back to Earth, to witness to The Power Of God, and what is
in store for the believers. When Paul was stoned to death in Lystra, he
was taken to Heaven, and saw the Glory of Heaven...but he was forbidden
to reveal them to us, saying "it's not lawful for a man to utter".
Gr> But if you want to claim persecution and lament how I have issues with
Gr> you praying, you go right ahead. But know that it's not the prayer
Gr> that offends me; it's the actions that those prayers evoke in those who
Gr> do the praying.
I have prayed that God would open your eyes, and that you would see The
Truth. But, if you don't even want to be prayed for, and you want nothing
else to do with God or Jesus Christ, then I will grant you your request.
I will stop this thread anytime you want...or I may quit answering your
messages.
Gr> This decree that you find yourself bound to makes no effort to examine
Gr> whether or not these beliefs are true. This amounts to fraud.
Again, WHO WOULD DIE FOR A LIE??!! Millions through the ages, including
the Apostles, died horrific deaths, rather than recant their faith in
Christ. They could've easily recanted their faith and lived...but they
chose death by such things as being burned at the stake, thrown to the
lions, impaled, crucified, sawed in half, etc.
DS> One day, we'll know who is right (the Christians or the
DS> non-Christians)... that fact can NOT be denied!!
Gr> There is no argument there. The problem is what do you do with this
Gr> one life that you KNOW we have. Do you turn a blind eye on it and
Gr> forsake it in lieu of a life you really have no way of knowing will
Gr> come your way?
By faith, I know what's coming my way...and it's far better than what
the life on Earth has been.
Gr> Just ask yourself. Why is there judgment at all? Why does there have
Gr> to be judgment? Why does there have to be a hell to punish the wrong
Gr> does? Why can't this god just take everybody to its bosom no matter
Gr> what? Why does your god keep a place of torment to keep people in
Gr> line? What does it have to lose if you don't toe the line? How does
Gr> it hurt it to do away with this place of torment?
Because The Lord Made The Rules. He created The Lake Of Fire for Satan
and his demons...and for all those who reject The Gospel.
Gr> That just illustrates to me that you have no desire for knowing the
Gr> truth about your beliefs. When have you ever critically examined your
Gr> beliefs? Where did they come from? How did you get them? What are the
Gr> linchpins? What would happen if one of those linchpins of your faith
Gr> were to be undone? Would you be prepared for the fallout if any of your
Gr> linchpins to your faith were ever removed?
In a word, faith. As I've said before, I've seen way too many evidences
of God working in my puny life, that those trump any and all of your
arguments.
No one has yet been able to disprove anything from the Bible. While there
are several prophecies that have not yet happened, they WILL occur.
Again, WHO WOULD DIE FOR A LIE?? Would YOU die for something you knew to
be a lie??
Since, you have no interest in what I have posted, I am not going to
waste any more time with you. Jesus Christ said "By your fruits, you
shall know them", and your posts tell me that you want nothing to do
with The Gospel.
In short, your blood is off of my hands.
Since you apparently want to pay for your own sins, go for it. Mine
are paid for by the Shed Blood Of Jesus Christ...and I can never thank
Him enough for what He did.
Daryl
... Bad Sign: Fortune Cookie warns of salmonella poisoning.
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